主题：【原创】看来欧盟要解除对华军售禁令了，猜猜中国可能买哪些 -- 唐鸢
家园 欧洲不可能跟中国的 文化理念都不同
家园 日本当年背离中国脱亚入欧美，毛子的表弟们前些年背离毛子 都说明文化理念固然重要，但国家利益是现实的。
家园 十几年内欧洲做中国的跟班？意淫么？醒醒！ 欧盟和中国的实力对比在改变，欧盟已经不能像过去那样随心所欲的拾掇中国了，利益也要慢慢的让一部分给中国，可是改变到欧盟做中国跟班的水平可能不是一两代人就能做到的。
你可以算算欧盟核心国家的实力和中国的GDP对比，科技的优势，话语权的优势，社会结构的优势，国民素质的优势，各阶层利益集团的结合柔顺程度。
最简单的几点，欧盟普通百姓对政府的认可度和国内能比么？腐败程度和中国能比么？房价收入比和中国能比么？法制健全和中国能比么？同档次的大学里面的教授水平能比么？企业整体水平能比么？除了中兴华为，中国有几个能拿的出手的企业。
中国产品威胁到欧洲就业的情况下中国产品一出纰漏欧洲媒体从核心的ZDF，《明镜》《Die Zeit》到地方电台，到路边三流小报就齐心协力的炒作，抹黑，轰炸，数月不绝，类似于狂欢。 再看看日本汽车威胁中国自有品牌汽车的情况下，这几天丰田出了这么大的纰漏，如此爆炸性，具有新闻性，世界各地都在报道的新闻，国内媒体从CCAV到Sina，汽车之家，地方电视台有一个把消息认认真真的报道了么？大部分甚至提都没提，为什么？ 不言而喻吧。
虽然现在是上升阶段，但是跟发达国家比，跟欧美比，中国的路还长的很，大家做好自己的工作，一个民族一步一个脚印慢慢走吧，我们这代人走不完下一代接着走。意淫对这个过程不会有任何帮助。
欧盟是一人一张选票的地区，中期的政治走向是什么很容易判断，就是精英阶层现阶段在对民众灌输什么，怎么洗脑。 多年前，欧洲的精英们通过掌握的媒体在给民众灌输美国的邪恶，自大和中国的进步。这几年欧洲的精英们在给民众用一个新菜单洗脑，那就是中国的邪恶，中国破坏欧洲生活方式，中国破坏世界和平，中国人迫害西藏人，迫害维族人，中国人自己迫害自己人，中国用有毒玩具残骸欧洲儿童。 很遗憾，欧洲的精英比中国的“精英”心齐，不是几百万公关费就能搞定的。 民众接受了洗脑，就要在以后的投票中表现出来，欧洲政府的行为就要表现出来。施罗德当政的时候都没有解禁，现在解禁？
家园 ..... 别人强大 就要放弃自己
别人危机 就以为真是老大
什么时候 建立自信 以我为主 他人为辅
家园 大部分同意，不过 非常同意你说的，首先应该清醒地认识自己的问题。这方面其实我们国家的领导做的不错，往往是美国人喊G2（昨天华尔街有两篇关于达沃斯的报导提到了这个概念），而中国领导拼命喊发展中国家。
不过，也应该认识到欧洲不是铁板一块。冰岛，就因为和英国荷兰欠债的问题，已经被某些英国报纸称为“恐怖主义国家”了。当然冰岛还不是欧盟成员，而作为欧盟成员的希腊，现在债台高筑，欧盟内部一个愿意帮忙的都没有，说怪话的到不少。现在希腊把很大希望寄托在中国身上，前几天准备向中国融资250亿欧元，不过暂时让中国据了。只能看下一轮谈判如何了。
所以欧盟内部矛盾很多，说是整合，其实每个欧盟国家对欧盟的向心力怎么能和中国的一个省，美国的一个州比呢？现在正是分化瓦解敌人的好机会，虽然让人家做跟班不可能，可是让欧盟内部自己离心离德，中国还是可以添把柴的。
- 复 大部分同意，不过
家园 buddy, 中国领导拼命喊发展中国家 do not be fooled by Chinese elites.
What they want in the end is a Chinese empire with regional control over Asia, with more living space and better terms in the global order.
"Every single empire, in its offical discourse, has said that it is not like all the others, that its circumstances are special, that it has a mission to enlighten, civilize, bring order and democracy, and it uses forces only as a last resort"--quoted from Edward Said.
China will just be another empire. Do not listen to what it says, look at what it does.
BTW, Greece is hard to rescue(still has not cleaned up its FAKED NATIONAL FINANCE DATA for the last 10 years) and next one to fall is P and then S. America finally got its revenging moment.
If China is smart enough, STEP ASIDE AND DO NOT FEED GREECE. Anyway, a weakened Europe is in China's interests. Remember how those hypocritical Frenchmen humiliated Chinese during the 2008 Olympic torch rally? All Europeans have the same hypocritical attitude towards China. Okay, now it is time for them to clean up their own s*.
家园 现在救希腊还太早，前几天一个希腊同学还说 希腊太弱小，加入欧盟可以互相帮助，不知道他这几天心情如何。另外，虽然我对法国印象也不好，但是你对法国好像非常讨厌，有没有什么原因？
家园 hehe 加入欧盟可以互相帮助，不知道他这几天心情如何 He must be very excited...
Anyway, Greeks got what they deserved. Greeks are people with the habit of "there are always tomorrows to do today's work". They were too face-conscious and were eager to lock itself into Euroland to ascertain its "europe" identity. They only wanted the lower government bond yield--a free gift from hard-savers such as Germans, but refused to pay the cost.
There is no free lunch. It is time to pay the price. 加入欧盟可以互相帮助--keep in mind, Greece is the origin of western civilization and western democracy. YOU, A CHINESE GUY FROM THE dictatorial communist China, is NEVER OF THEIR pack(deeply in their heart). Greeks never trust anything that's EATERN. So now let's their Western European brothers to rescue them.
Look at UK--Britons are clearly smarter and more rational. The benefit of single currency is way lower than the cost of single currency, both for Greece and Britons. When Germany/France designed single-currency in mind, they only wanted to have 6 countries tied together. PIIGs are never welcome in the Germanic cycle.
虽然我对法国印象也不好，但是你对法国好像非常讨厌，有没有什么原因？
--you are wrong.I am a big fan of French food, wine, cheese, arts, history, painting, buildings, language.
But I am ethnically Chinese and I know where China's interests are. France is like a woman and never understand where is its appropriate status on the global stage. IT IS NEVER A RELIABLE PARTNER, NO A TRUSTWORTHY FRIEND OR A CONSISTENT DEAL MAKER. EU is a tool for France to exert influence way above its national strength. Ever since 1960s when EEC came into existence, America had been alerted at its every movement. You can look at JFK's comments on EEC.
You need to have this British common sense in geopolitics: a divided continent is always better than a unified continent. Friends are not eternal, adversary is not perpetual. It is your national interests that is eternal and perpetual.
家园 没有那么简单 I agree with you on China's policy in becoming a regional dominant player, only not sure about the term “empire”, which remind people of military invasion, colonization, etc. I think China want more respect and better living standard for its citizens.
As for the matter with Greece, it is complicated. Yes those European bastards and hypocrites humiliated last year and still hold vile thoughts against us. But we can use them as a leverage to play Europeans and Americans against each other, just like we played USSR and US against each other. Not to mention as the original post discussed: if they have something we need why not "rescue" them and get the technology we need? A weak Europe is good for us, but a eventually collapsed Europoe may not be the case.
A side thought is that Greeks, among all Europeans, are generally more friendly to us.
- 复 大部分同意，不过
家园 .... 欧盟内部确实不够齐心 但是大的整合趋势还在
要说搞离心离德 还不如放在欧美这个框架内比较现实
家园 同档次的大学里面的教授水平能比么？ 想说中国教授在玩泥巴，有觉得太伤人自尊心拉。可是确实如此呀。我给一个地质海洋反面的教授改过文章，实在想不出来他们在做什么研究和什么叫研究。我可以给他支出N个有价值的方向，但实在不想多管闲事。改文章的时候就骂过他好几次了。
家园 你这个“十几年内”数字从哪来的？我没有给出过时间表 我只是说明这是一个趋势，欧盟不是一个国家，只是一个联盟，他的总实力并不是所有欧盟国家实力之和，而是要小。具体时间将看中美欧力量对比的变化及国际局势的变化，但趋势是这个。毛子衰落后他的表兄弟们投入美国怀抱，美国还没明显衰落日本就开始回归亚洲。国家利益是现实的。