主题：【原创】以人民的名义 -- 中国对日走出好局 -- 萨苏
家园 可能的结局是： 政治行为和经济行为走向彻底分离。这种分离十年前就在国内开始自上而下贯彻执行，深入人心。有人戏称这种政经行为分离为：闷声发财。
家园 上海这次逮捕了十来个 据说会判五年以下的徒刑，究竟怎么判，就看上海政府的意思了。我想上海之所以这么严，是担心这次的示威和房价上涨联系起来，形势就麻烦了。
家园 日本政府不一定会理会中国的民意 前面没意见，萨兄好文，花一吨。
后面对日有点问题。日本政府不一定会理会中国的民意，起多大作用还要看胡这一级的会谈。从经济上看，合作降温的可能性比较大。不过小泉还要应付国内的压力，会有些变数。
这次游行效果极佳，用新华社的话说就是把日本历史问题国际化。
家园 昨天今天连续两天，上海主流媒体开始大规模行动，企图给反日降温 解放日报、新闻晨报等大报又是转载人民日报，又是自己的评论员文章，还有什么一个普通市民的来信，MSN上普通网友的心声，吴建民等精英、大官的讲话就不用提了，一个方向――再游行就是不爱国了，要相信党和政府的能力云云。
老实说，对于现在胡及层峰的外交能力，我还是比较信任的，至少比前核心强。但这种过完河就拆桥，急吼吼一点过渡都没有的作为实在令人不快。我猜测了，除了一向的官老爷派头外，也是被这次的规模有点吓着了。上海不是一向被认为、被讽刺为中国最商业化、最冷漠的地方吗？结果此次好象规模最大。
这次系列游行及网上签名抗议的效果出乎意料的好，我认为如果不是最近民间的一系列自发举措，政府在对日外交上不可能获得目前的主动地位。外交部抗议了多少次，有过一丁点作用吗？连争取国际主流媒体关注都没有做到，真不知道吴建民有什么理由和资格那么批评学生和群众，正是所谓肉食者鄙。
家园 任何言论都可以认为是外交的需要 呵呵，我们自家人知道自家事就可以了
家园 一杯开水就砸过去?C你今天不给我们这位小姐道歉就别想出这个门！ 好!!!!
家园 也和掌握国家经济发展建设决策的"主流学者"有关 经济政治.以前谈独立自主变得闭关锁国。
现在谈改革开放变成独立不能自主。
家园 以民间 对民间 说实话 这会的中日纷争 我们的手法成熟多了 近年来, 日本在对华的强硬政策上,不断地利用民间当挡箭牌.钓鱼岛, 教科书... 与以往相比, 我们没有单纯的抗议,因为目标不对.所以,放手让民间来对民间 回旋余地就大多了. 如果不出昏招,这次算是扳平.
家园 苏联解体的时候 几乎没人站出来为之抗争。为什么？支持苏联和共产党的人大有人在，为什么没人上街去对抗叶利钦？真正的反对派不会因为一纸禁令就裹足不前。压制民间舆情最终只能削弱党和政府自己的力量。当然不是说这次就是压制。但还是看得出。。。。。某种担忧吧－－－－－我认为是无谓的。
家园 萨大神人啊 上海游行前一个星期短信网络邮件满天飞，公司里的年轻人凑到一起的第一句话都是“周六你去不去？”政府没吭声，周五晚上我莫名其妙收到一条短信，内容如下：
市公安局治安总局重申：根据法律规定，游行要经过批准，群众表达爱国热情要有序理智合法。通过正当途径表达爱国热情，自觉遵守法制，自觉维护秩序。
内容奥妙无穷啊。
游行完毕，本周开始国际形势宣讲团做巡回报告，报纸开始声称未经批准游行为违法行为，这可不就是在收口子了嘛。
家园 本届政府或其码是他们的参谋圈。 有一种亲日倾向，这点我在当初马立诚的事后就感觉到了，马的事不是独立的，特别是当年在遇到强反弹后，他跑到凤凰去，这些人有一个幻想，那就是联日抗美，希望通过丢弃历史问题，来进一步加深中日关系，但这实际上根本不可能，因为不论中日的经贸连的多紧，一旦美国要对付日本，不论是从经济上还是军事上，中国根本没有能力支援日本，而如果中国要对付日本，美国却可以帮日本对付中国。
在这种情况下日本要是把对华关系放在对美关系之上，只有一种可能，那就是日本人的脑子进水了。
我不明白上层为什么会有这种幻想，开头以为自己可能误判，但这两年看下来，不仅这件事，有不少第一印象，恐怕是正确的。
仅就压制游行和反日活动来说，虽然太过生硬，但还没出大格，关键是投不投否决票，以及日后的对日态度，上届政府有亲美倾向，吃了不少亏以后，才算有所纠正，如果马等人的那套大行其道，那我们又要吃亏了，
在中国拥有超过美的实力前，日本和我们的关系根本不可能超过日美关系，这不是想象，是形势造成的。
家园 【鹿透社消息】小日本道歉了!! （英文版） Japanese PM apologises for colonial past
Japanese Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi apologised today for the "tremendous damage and suffering" caused by Japan's wartime past in an apparent effort to help douse a flaming row with China.
Koizumi made the apology during a speech at a multilateral summit in Jakarta in front of leaders from 100 Asian and African countries including Chinese President Hu Jintao, whom he is likely to meet in the coming days.
Japan's foreign minister had said the fence-mending talks would probably take place today but a Japanese government source said this was unlikely.
Officials were trying to arrange a meeting for sometime tomorrow or later, the source said.
"In the past, Japan, through its colonial rule and aggression, caused tremendous damage and suffering to the people of many countries, particularly to those of Asian nations," Koizumi said during the opening of the Asia-Africa summit.
"Japan squarely faces these facts of history in a spirit of humility," he said, adding that the Japanese people have engraved in their minds "feelings of deep remorse and heartfelt apology".
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AdvertisementThe apology conforms with past statements by Tokyo but such an admission in front of an international audience is rare.
Relations between the two Asian economic powerhouses are at their worst since they normalised ties in 1972.
Thousands have demonstrated in cities across China the past three weekends in violent protests against Japanese textbooks that critics say whitewashes its wartime history and Tokyo's campaign for a permanent seat on the UN Security Council.
Both sides have, however, been making some soothing noises in an effort to keep relations from unravelling and damaging economic ties worth $US212 billion ($A273.55 billion) in annual trade.
But in a development that could stir fresh outrage in China, 80 Japanese members of parliament turned out today to pay their respects to Japan's war dead at a Tokyo shrine that has become a symbol of the animosity.
A spokesman for the group said the visits to the Yasukuni Shrine were intended to honour the dead and pray for peace, not to anger China or South Korea, both of which were victims of Japanese military aggression.
Ties with China chilled markedly after Koizumi took office in 2001 and began annual visits to Yasukuni. He has not visited yet this year.
In brief comments when he arrived in Jakarta yesterday, Hu said he looked forward to talks with other leaders on Asia-Africa cooperation but did not touch on the Japan tension.
The dispute has unnerved Asian countries and overshadowed the summit in Jakarta, being held to commemorate the 1955 Asia-Africa Conference in Bandung, which gathered former colonised nations from the two continents for the first time.
Koizumi told the summit that Japan planned to double its official development assistance to African nations over the next three years and provide the bulk of it in grant aid.
Analysts have said Japan sees increasing its foreign aid to poor countries as a way to bolster its bid for a seat on the UN Security Council, which is steadfastly opposed by China.
Speaking at a business dinner last night, Hu said China would adhere to peaceful development in a bid to allay regional fears in the wake of the anti-Japanese protests at home and a new law mandating war against Taiwan.
Indeed, mixed signals have emanated from Beijing as the government seeks to rein in anti-Japan protests while insisting they were triggered by Tokyo's refusal to deal with its past.
Beijing has refused Tokyo's demand for an apology and compensation for the damage caused to Japanese property in the demonstrations. China has also said its people should not take part in unapproved protests.
One of the big areas of contention has been disputed waters in the East China Sea.
Today, the Yomiuri Shimbun newspaper reported Japan was set to agree to a proposal by China to discuss joint development of gas fields in the region.
Japanese Trade Minister Shoichi Nakagawa said he was not aware that China had made such a proposal, but he did not rule out joint development.
- Reuters
家园 等等看 也许适得其反