五千年(敝帚自珍)

主题:印度胜了?还完胜? -- jent

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  • 家园 印度胜了?还完胜?

    1,印度的所有诉求,有哪一点达到了?

    1.a,洞朗区是中印争议区?

    1.b,洞朗区是中不争议区,印度代不丹讨公道?

    1.c,洞朗区事关印度安全,中方不得驻军(修路的目的是驻军)?

    没有,一条都没有达到。

    2,中国的所有诉求,有哪一点没达到?

    2.a,印度撤回去。。。达到了

    2.b,这是中印非争议区。。。见华姐姐的说法:继续驻军,继续巡逻,继续。。。

    2.c,这里跟印度无关。。。见华姐姐的说法:继续驻军,继续巡逻,继续。。。

    如此,印度胜在哪里?中国又输在哪里?

    通宝推:潜望镜,wage,三笑,林风清逸,mezhan,青颍路,潜龙在田,
    • 家园 再说去年(2017)六月到八月究竟发生了什么

      看图吧

      点看全图

      外链图片需谨慎,可能会被源头改

      刚刚更新不久的,洞朗地区的卫星图。

      可以下载下来放大了看

    • 家园 洞朗真相。。。原来如此

      图片说明比什么都有意义。

      正在向南延伸的公路。。。

      点看全图

      外链图片需谨慎,可能会被源头改

      这是给直升机准备的么?

      点看全图

      外链图片需谨慎,可能会被源头改

      最前沿的建设:对峙地,多卡拉

      点看全图

      外链图片需谨慎,可能会被源头改

      点看全图

      外链图片需谨慎,可能会被源头改

      点看全图

      外链图片需谨慎,可能会被源头改

      点看全图

      外链图片需谨慎,可能会被源头改

      受惊了,搞点工程压压惊

      点看全图

      外链图片需谨慎,可能会被源头改

      通宝推:木雅之岗,
    • 家园 洞朗前沿最新通报

      印度无人机坠落洞朗

      消息来源:

      12月7日(昨天),印方承认无人机入侵中国,以跨越了锡金段的实际控制线为词辩解。

      对印方而言,锡金段与中国的边界已经划定。唯一不定的,就是洞朗一段。当然对中方而言,这一段也是定界。

      另一个确信的消息是: 中方首先披露此事。而且是由西部战区联合参谋部作战局副局长证实此事,并明确指出,我方进行了查证,识别工作。

      由此,可以确认前几天模模糊糊的一事:入冬后,洞朗地区我方驻军依旧。

      • 家园 印度无人机可能不是坠落在洞朗

        而是在下面的亚东谷地。

        https://www.ccthere.net/article/4288303

      • 家园 三哥摔无人机又摔上瘾了

        就说今年的吧,公开报道的有,四月三哥空军摔了一架国产Lakshya无人机,八月空军再摔了一架,型号未公开,上个月印度副总统视察海军基地时海军摔了一架以色列Searcher无人机,现在陆军不甘落后,又摔了一架以色列Heron无人机。

      • 家园 这时候老广不见了
      • 家园 一帮人就是找借口骂tg
    • 家园 大概算得上是最新的消息了

      替换11月30日,在国防部召开的11月例行记者会上,国防部新闻局局长、国防部新闻发言人吴谦就记者提出的“中国军队今年冬天没有按惯例撤离洞朗”一事进行了回应称:洞朗地区是中国领土,我们将根据这一原则,自主决定部队的部署

      外链出处

    • 家园 这。。。算是真相么?

      印度人的一家之言:

      大意就是,印军换防。新来的不知前面的人经常干些什么。于是误判了土共军队,误做了不该做的事,结果就是完全丧失了以前的地位与便利(原本就不该有,但是历史的因素被错误地拥有)。

      至于土共,压根就没新修路这回事。路早在十多年前就已经在那里了。呵呵呵

      Doklam: How India misjudged China’s intentions and it escalated into a major standoff

      The India-China military standoff at Doklam was apparently based on Indian misperception of Chinese intentions.

      An alternative narration of events leading to the military standoff suggests that the skirmish might have been blown out of proportion and was completely unnecessary. And even though eventually the standoff was resolved through diplomatic negotiations, India was not a net gainer at the end of it.

      The Chinese army personnel are still present at a distance of 250 metres from the site of the confrontation. This is where they were before June 16. The Indian Army meanwhile has vacated the area that the Chinese wanted vacated.

      According to sources in the security establishment, the standoff which was projected as a result of Chinese road construction activity in the Doklam area was anything but that. A Chinese motorable road apparently already exists in the area. It has been there since 2003 or 2005, according to different estimates.

      The standoff, according to these sources, had its origins not in any road-construction activity in the disputed area between China and Bhutan but in the destruction of two Indian Army bunkers in the area.

      There are apparently two dozen bunkers in that area. Known as Self-Help Bunkers (SBH), they are not occupied all the time. The Chinese have for long objected to two bunkers that they claim have been built in an area which is within their perception line of their border with Bhutan.

      Although Bhutan claims the area, Indian Army units under the control of 17 Mountain Division at Gangtok in Sikkim, patrol it. This includes the area where the two disputed bunkers are located.

      The Chinese periodically use bulldozers to destroy the two bunkers whenever they are unoccupied. The Indian Army units patrolling the area equally periodically reconstruct them. This is not considered unusual activity in a disputed border area. Since this is China’s border with Bhutan but is patrolled by the Indian Army, the issue is never raised to a higher pitch.

      In November 2007 also the Chinese Peoples’ Liberation Army (PLA) had moved into Bhutan's Doklam Plateau and demolished a hut close to some Indian bunkers. The hut was apparently a rest house used by the Indian Army. The Indian side kept the matter quiet as the bunkers were located in Bhutan but manned by Indian Army personnel. In July that year, the PLA had also written to the 17 Mountain Division Headquarters about two “illegal” Indian bunkers but they were at Batangla near the disputed tri-junction (where the borders of India, Bhutan and China meet) warning of “adverse consequences” if they were not removed. The matter was swept under the carpet as the two armies were to conduct joint exercises a month later in December 2007. In 2008 also the PLA had destroyed two bunkers in precisely the same area in Doklam where this June’s standoff took place.

      Whenever new Indian Army unit are deployed in the area, the outgoing units apparently don’t inform the incoming unit that the breaking and reconstruction of these two bunkers in particular takes place routinely.

      According to sources, this summer when a new army unit was deployed for patrolling the area they decided to spruce up the bunkers, including the two disputed ones. The PLA soldiers suddenly saw something new happening– the Indian soldiers were painting the two bunkers in question in regulation brownish-saffron army colour. The PLA soldiers could not comprehend the enthusiasm of the newly deployed Indian army unit and thought that something more permanent was being built.

      Predictably, when the bunkers were unoccupied, the PLA brought out its bulldozers and demolished the bunkers. When the Indian patrol discovered this, not knowing the previous history of such demolitions and reconstructions, they informed their superior officers about the aggressiveness of the Chinese.

      The message that Chinese bulldozers were in action in Doklam, according to sources, went all the way up to the Major General who is the General Officer Commanding of the 17 Mountain Division based at Gangtok. He in turn informed his bosses in Army Headquarters in Delhi.

      Sources claim that the Chinese use of bulldozers was linked to possible road construction activities by the army authorities sitting in Gangtok. They presumed that the Chinese were extending the existing road from Doka La (Doka Pass) through the Doklam Plateau towards the Bhutan Army camp at Zompelri near the Jampheri Ridge.

      The senior army officers in Delhi also believed the road construction theory and instructed the local army unit to prevent any road construction and stay put. Bhutan was taken on board and a full-scale military standoff began. General Bipin Rawat in fact visited both the 17 Mountain Division at Gangtok and the 27 Mountain Division at Kalimpong to boost the morale of his forces and take stock of the ground situation.

      The Chinese, meanwhile, could not fathom why India was over-reacting. The Chinese media went on the offensive; and on the Indian side, security experts exaggerated and overplayed the strategic threat to India from the Chinese road construction activity. A full-scale propaganda war over claims, counter-claims and charges and counter-charges began.

      At the end of it, through a “near-simultaneous” withdrawal of forces to pre-June 16 positions, the standoff was resolved. Both sides claimed victory but the Chinese went back only 250 metres while to maintain peace India had to give up patrolling the area where two destroyed bunkers had existed. The Chinese got what they wanted.

      Although the military standoff is behind us, perhaps an assessment still needs to be made of the strategic cost-benefit analysis of the confrontation, the nature of information flow, the response and analysis systems within the Indian armed forces and the wisdom of the current crop of Indian Army commanders.

      • 家园 感觉像是印度人找的借口,就像日本当年说”俺们制式只是找一

        个失踪的士兵啊,没想跟中国打仗的“。谁知道你们就不理解俺们, 而是发动了抗日战争打了八年。你看看这误解,造成多大的损失啊。

        不管印度人是什么原因, 它的军队的行动是有印度最高执政者首肯的, 这就足够说明一切了。其他的,都是小节,只需了解,而无需过多关注。

      • 家园 大棋党口口声声修路的才是进攻方

        一切尽在掌握云云。

        如今一篇印媒报道立刻自打嘴巴,呵呵,变的还真是快。

        至于土共,压根就没新修路这回事。路早在十多年前就已经在那里了。呵呵呵

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