五千年(敝帚自珍)

主题:【原创】印度崛起:神话与现实 -- 晨枫

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    • 家园 印度版刘晓波:把印度租给中国200年

      http://www.indianexpress.com/news/dont-blame-democracy-for-bad-governance/683662/0

      Don’t blame democracy for bad governance

      This is a week when I feel especially hopeless about India’s future. A week in China has caused this gloomy mood. I have just returned from the World Economic Forum’s ‘Summer Davos’ in the city of Tianjin. I had not heard of Tianjin till two weeks ago and, because I was told that it was near Beijing, expected an obscure dormitory town. So when I found myself in a magnificent, modern city of shiny skyscrapers, spectacular bridges and fine boulevards, I was stunned. Even more so when I heard that the city has been built in the past decade and then I found myself reduced to speechless wonder when I heard that Tianjin’s amazing, futuristic Convention Centre took just nine months to build. There were Indian officials and businessmen at the meeting whose mouths fell open when they heard.

      哥们从天津的世界经济论坛回到印度后对印度的前途很沮丧,很绝望。他以前从来都没有听说过天津这个城市,以为是个破地方,但天津让他震惊了。

      We chattered amongst ourselves in Hindi about why such a Convention Centre would take ten years to build in India and agreed that it could be because democratic processes take longer than totalitarian ones. Then we went to Tianjin railway station to take the high speed train to Beijing and we stopped making excuses for the Motherland. Tianjin railway station looks like Delhi’s new international airport and the train that covered the 130 kilometres to Beijing in thirty minutes is faster and more modern than any I have ever been on. When we got to Beijing, the Indians I was with, were as angry as I was at how far India had been left behind by a country that till the seventies was at least twenty years behind us.

      他们很震惊天津的发展速度,对和谐号非常吃惊,马上开始对他们的民主制度开始批判。他们很愤怒,因为70年代的时候,中国落后印度至少20年。

      。。。

      Meanwhile, the country from which our Lefties, Liberals and Maoists get inspiration, has moved with spectacular success towards a market economy. When I twittered about this, someone twittered back that perhaps we should lease India to the Chinese for the next 200 years. It might come to that if

      we do not buck up.

      当我把上述内容放到我的推客(twitter)上的时候,有人说:我们应该把印度租给中国200年。

      这个非常符合YST对民主的论述:YST对美元有很精彩的论述。当经济上出现落后的时候,他们就对民主制度怀疑了。美国的精英也对美国的民主制度开始怀疑:美国精英对美国选票制度的批判

      通宝推:唵啊吽,

      本帖一共被 2 帖 引用 (帖内工具实现)
      • 家园 经济决定政治

        这话一点也没错。

      • 家园 哦耶,终于知道常凯申是怎么拼写的了。

        By: Huo | 28-Sep-2010

        I agree absolutely with Dr. Srinvasan that "Democracy is not just elections and free speech". In Taiwan they have too much elections and free speech. Every year there is an election in Taiwan and the politicians spend half of the time in campaigning. Taiwan became prosperous after the authoritative rule of the Chiang Kai Shek and his son but started to decline after following democracy. The two main parties became polarised and spent all their time in "saliva wars". The Taiwanese are pretty educated and yet democacy does not work. In contrast, their Mainland brother is doing much better despite the fact that it is much poorer and has much more problems.

        这位应该是个华人。

      • 家园 是印度自己学艺不精,上了卖拐的当

        我们再学印度就叫上了二道贩子的当。

        民主当然是要好领导的。选举制度第一目的就是选领导者,制衡属于并列目的。选能人这个并列的目的经常被偏废,搞得选举制似乎就是为了隔4年整个啥也做不了的人上去坐椅子。让领导做不了坏事很重要,更重要的前提是要选能做事的领导。美国人讲选领导要选有领导魅力的、有continental reputation的,因为领导者要有momentum,连吓带哄要能赶得动官僚机构、国会这群羊;领导要有distinguished record of service to the republic,不然选个不会做事的我们瞎折腾什么?

        自由的花要整天拿爱国者的血去浇浇,民主制度也经常要好领导来调教一下。

        • 家园 其实选举对选民的素质和经济发展要求非常高

          选民的素质越低,越不能选出合适的领导人.经济发展水平低,选民接受各项信息的能力低的话,就不能作出正确的判断.印度那种情况,选不出好领导人是正常的,能选出才是不正常的.

          就是中国,以我接受信息比较多的情况下,你让我直选国家领导人,我都不知道选谁好!!!

          • 家园 同意

            在金字塔形的社会,民主选举最后的结果肯定是一些奇奇怪怪的人和想法。因为绝大多数的选择都会是杀富济贫什么的。

            只有社会是纺锤形或者圆柱形的时候,民主才是各方博弈或者平衡利益的有效方式。

          • 家园 追溯到古希腊

            他们的民主,发生在自由民中间,就是奴隶主中间吧。这些人所受的教育,总的来说应该比妇女和奴隶要高。再说,奴隶主的群体,人数应该不多,人和人之间因该比较了解,比如哪个人头脑比大多数人好有领导能力,哪个人力大无穷善于打仗,大家都很清楚,于是需要国王或者统帅的时候,大家的选举不会出大的偏差。

            我基本同意你的看法:选举对选民的素质和经济发展要求非常高

          • 家园 追溯到古希腊

            他们的民主,发生在自由民中间,就是奴隶主中间吧。这些人所受的教育,总的来说应该比妇女和奴隶要高。再说,奴隶主的群体,人数应该不多,人和人之间因该比较了解,比如哪个人头脑比大多数人好有领导能力,哪个人力大无穷善于打仗,大家都很清楚,于是需要国王或者统帅的时候,大家的选举不会出大的偏差。

            我基本同意你的看法:选举对选民的素质和经济发展要求非常高

        • 家园 "The tree of liberty must

          be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." by Thomas Jefferson

          "Patriotism is a vicious virtue"-by Oscar Wilde

          From 《The Rock》

          印像好深刻啊。

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