五千年(敝帚自珍)

主题:【原创】印度崛起:神话与现实 -- 晨枫

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      • 家园 这个印度哥们的回帖很精准

        http://www.indianexpress.com/comments/dont-blame-democracy-for-bad-governance/683662/

        Democracy as an excuse By: Keith |

        Thursday , 23 Sep '10 7:20:10 AM Reply | Forward

        Sad fact is that India does use democracy as an excuse. Indians look at China and say she has abused her populous and forced them to build the shiny cities, something that India cannot do due to the rule of law and democracy. Strange how India was able to evite 140,000 poor families to make space for the Commonwealth games despite democracy and rule of law. The difference between China and India is less about the government system, its not about authoritarian or democracy. The real difference is that the Chinese government is pragmatic and has thrown ideology out the window. What on earth can be more incompatible than communism and capitalism working side by side? Indians claim they have the advantage of democracy. This is my prediction, the chinese government is pragmatic enough to adopt democracy if and when it suits them. Where will India's advantage lie then?

        中国和印度的差别不是政治体制,而是他们中国的实用主义。要是中国人觉得民主适合他们的时候,他们也一定会选择民主的。到那个时候,我们印度还有什么优势呢?

        回上面一帖的

        Democracy a farce/ it is feudalism a la carteBy: Dr.G.Srinivasan | Sunday , 26 Sep '10 10:57:54 AM Reply |

        Absolutely right!!! We do have a feudal setup where we either elect Indira gandhi rajiv gandhi sonia gandhi and Rahul our leaders. A dmaned feudal setup !!!! Now to top it we have an appointed PM for two terms of or whom none of the indians cast a single vote in any election!!! The wings of democracy the legioslatur the judiciary and the executive the office of the PM, president the CBI the CVC and the CEC everything ids under the control of AICC chairperson.Do we call it democracy?

        绝对正确。我们实际上是一个封建体制。该死的封建体制。。。我们的体制真是民主吗?

        ----

        评论还都挺中肯,不翻译了,有兴趣可以去看看。看来有不少印度人在反思了,对中国来说好坏参半。

        • 家园 西霉把这种情形美其名曰为

          “南亚民主模式”:

          We do have a feudal setup where we either elect Indira gandhi rajiv gandhi sonia gandhi and Rahul our leaders.

          贝布托遇刺后,其党把她的儿子选为该当主席,其丈夫被选为国家总理,BBC电台的专家公开声称这种家族继任为““南亚民主模式”。这种基本上是家族传接的作法要是换成西方不待见的国家头脑,还不被西霉轰成渣。。。

        • 家园 这儿也有篇印度人的反思。

          http://www.ptfcn.com/?post=55

          印度的精英阶层非常厉害。

          看印度笑话的同时,我们自己也得努力啊。我们的目标只有美国。

    • 家园 一个去过印度的人的现身说法

      http://www.mitbbs.com/article/Military/34406169_0.html

      写文是不可能了。不过可以简单说两句。

      偶是两三年前出差的印度一个据说是前几名的一个大城市。偶还没到印度,在飞机上调整手表时才第一次知道原来有些地方时差居然不是整点数的,而是有半个小时时差。非常惊奇--偶还是第一去这种地方。飞机到了以后,觉得走到了三十年多前国内某大中城市的火车站。回去的时候才知道,该机场好象只有一个侯机厅。第一眼看到的有印象的文字就是:Incredible India。的确是非常的Incredible。

      该城市的开发区是新建的办公楼,有些IT公司的园地建设的非常漂亮,那些热带的植被让人觉得特别有异国情调。但是这只是这个城市极小的一部分。大部分的城市几乎和国内县城一个水平(国内县城的建筑也很新的,单从这点,这个印度城市连现在的国内县城也比不了):尘土飞扬,摩托以及拉客的小蓬蓬车到处都是,空气一点都不清新,让人觉得焦躁。对了,印度好象没有交通规则,小蓬蓬车到处拐,到处超车。我们还看到路上有牛拉车,还有闲散的牛。

      偶和几个同事出去玩,他们的景点那叫一个脏,一个旧(我真不知道中国城市几十年前是否也是这样)。兜售各种东西的小贩在景点附近满大街。一些小孩子追着我们到处跑,还有要钱的。当然,偶们可不敢给钱怕被围住。我们在一家印度餐馆吃饭的时候,那真是很奇特的场面:所有印度人都用手抓饭吃。那家餐馆的厕所里没手纸,但是有盛满水的水桶,这可能符合某些网上的说法。其实这些都是民族习惯问题,到也没什么可多说的。

      有一点我必须写,在印度我第一次见到贫民窟。一张一张肮脏发黑的小帐篷排成一大片,一个小帐篷就是一户人家。这样的贫民窟我们见到了好几个。我当时心里只有一个想法,希望这种贫民窟永远别在中国出现。希望中国别让无良精英们掌权,别让他们剥夺农民土地,别让农民流离失所。

      其他想不起来了。不过每个国家的普通人都一样骈手胝足,印度的普通人也是得通过劳动过日子的。我觉得印度很悲哀因为他们有那样一个低效的政府,这可能是由历史和民族习性共同决定的。去过印度的人可能对中国政府取得的成就看法更正面,对49年建立起来的中国政府看法更正面。

      【 在 tsingyuan (空空道人) 的大作中提到: 】

      : 你去过印度?

      : 写篇文章讲讲啊

    • 家园 德里快讯:南非官员发现运动员房间里有蛇!

      德里快讯:南非官员发现运动员房间里有蛇!

      说是选手住宅里面有蛇: http://tinyurl.com/2gxpgas

      Snake in athlete's room at Games village, claims SA envoy

      NEW DELHI: There seems to be no end to the problems confronting the organisers of the Commonwealth Games with the South African envoy claiming that a snake was found in an athlete's room in the village.

      A snake was found in a room in the residential tower, earmarked for the South African athletes, who have not arrived yet, High Commissioner Harris Mbulelo Mejeke told reporters.

      "We can't go and stay till things are fixed up. We have very grave concerns. If snakes are found we can't ask our teams to stay there. Yesterday we found a snake but I don't know whether it was an Indian snake. But it was there in one of our rooms," Mejeke said before entering the village.

      "That was a threat to the lives of our athletes. Very disappointing. Basically, the basement was full of water and the staircase was also damp," he said.

      On being asked if he brought the matter to the notice of the organisers, he said, "We had someone with us. They have promised us, everything will be all right. I will go and check whether the promise has been kept," he said.

      However, the South African envoy said there team will not withdraw from the controversy-marred event.

      "The teams are coming and we are still part of the Commonwealth Games. When everything will be done we will call our teams," Mjeke said.

      The village has already been sharply criticised for the unhygienic conditions and now the sensational claim would bring more bad publicity to the event.

      • 家园 三哥的评论很有意思。

        http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/cwgopinions/6631057.cms

        Siddharth (New Delhi)

        26 Sep, 2010 10:27 PM

        Quick blame Pakistan and the ISI for this! it always works the rest of the time

        责怪巴基斯坦的ISI干的,这种方法以前一直有效。

        murali (chennai)

        26 Sep, 2010 09:13 PM

        Throw that snake on our politicians.

        扔到我们的政客身上去。

        Mahagandoo (USA)

        26 Sep, 2010 08:48 PM

        Just pay the Indian Snake Ten Dollars and it will go away

        给这条印度蛇10美元,它自动就走了(隐射印度的贪污无处不在)。

        Rakesh (Ahmedabad)

        26 Sep, 2010 08:18 PM

        Surprising to see kallus complaining about snakes. There are no snakes in south africa or what? Anyway must be better than south africa slum

        (印度自大狂)kallus的抱怨我觉得很奇怪。南非没有蛇吗?我们新德里的运动员村肯定比南非的贫民窟强。

        Vijay (delhi)

        26 Sep, 2010 08:11 PM

        Thank God, dinosaurs are extinct.

        感谢上帝,还好,恐龙已经灭绝了。

        C Suresh (Charlotte, USA)

        26 Sep, 2010 08:08 PM

        I work in USA and I have seen many snakes in my office corridors. Most of the todays land is due to removal for forests. This is just another one. Surprised world papers making a big fuss out of this. Our Government should give better responses for the problems.

        (在美印度人)我在美国工作,这边的办公室的走廊里面也有蛇(真的?)。我们的土地都是从森林中夺来的。世界的媒体为什么要大惊小怪啊!我们的政府应该给这个问题更好的回答。(怎么回答?)

        ss rathore (visakhapatnam)

        26 Sep, 2010 07:52 PM

        there is nothing to fear as that snake is our indian logo for commonwealth. it will be worn around kalmadi's neck on the opening ceremony.

        没有什么好怕的。蛇是我们英联邦运动会的会标。开幕式的时候,它会在kalmadi(印度英联邦运动会主席*)的脖子上。

    • 家园 广州日报挤兑三哥

      可能是同样是近期举办大型运动会的原因了,广州日报今天在大赞自己十年一大便的同时,也把目光投向了被英联邦运动会困扰的印度。

      外链出处

      上面标题看不太清楚,这里帮打一下“新德里英联邦运动会未开幕先出丑——印度“大国秀”受拷问”。

      看了看内文,如都是拷的真实客观,那真让人开眼了。举文中的几个例子:

      1、8月16日,组秀会召开新闻发布会,原定公布由印度著名音乐人拉曼制作的主题歌。然而,拉曼在演唱了主题歌的第一句歌词后就说,主题歌还没有完全准备好,“我还得打磨一些旋律,作进一步修改。”

      2、预算,2003年为5亿美元,到现在各项开支为46亿美元。钱去哪了呢,有报道称在本届运动会开支清单上可以看到一些令人震惊的价格:一卷卫生纸200美元,一个急救套装130美元,租一把雨伞130美元。

      3、印度反腐败机构的报告称有至少14个场馆的建设存在违规,一些比赛场馆的建筑合格证书是“伪造或真实性存疑”。举重场馆在启用数小时后漏雨,游泳馆掉天花致一名运动员受伤,还有一座体育馆的屋顶倒塌,被近重建。

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